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what do normal people think about ? You are now viewing the what do normal people think about ? thread.
  1. #11 October 14th, 2013

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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrei View Post
    I never understood someone involved in entertainment - after having watched a display of some skill, describing someone as "having too much time on their hands". Doesn't that seem a little silly and totally insecure about oneself? Especially when those very same critics are people who have put time into learning and perfecting their OWN craft? Kind of applies to everybody that says it, we're all trying to be good at something. I see it a lot from magicians with regards to cardistry - but I digress. Not that anyone here would have said such a thing... haha
    Same reason people make fun of nerds: they don't see the value in it or how it in any way enhances someone's life. You prove them wrong by creating value. People don't make fun of Peter Jackson. Yeah, he's a nerd. But he's also a nerd who won 11 Oscars.

    That is not dead, which can eternal lie
    And with strange eons, even death may die

    Witching Hour Productions
    The Pitt and the Pendulum
  2. #12 October 14th, 2013

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    [QUOTE=Andrei;413869]I never understood someone involved in entertainment - after having watched a display of some skill, describing someone as "having too much time on their hands". Doesn't that seem a little silly and totally insecure about oneself? Especially when those very same critics are people who have put time into learning and perfecting their OWN craft? Kind of applies to everybody that says it, we're all trying to be good at something. I see it a lot from magicians with regards to cardistry - but I digress. Not that anyone here would have said such a thing... haha
    /QUOTE]

    This is what I mean by too much time on their hands. They do XMC all the time. They have no other hobbies. I have other interest outside of magic. It is because of that I don't have to use magic as a crutch in social gatherings. So, people don't think I have too much time on my hands. Or that I'm a magic nerd. Or all I can talk about is magic.

    My biggest problem is these kids will walk up to the middle of a crowd I build doing my busking act and start doing their thing. They have the time to learn to juggle cards but not enough time to learn not to try and steel someone else's crowd. When not to perform. They need to learn the social skills needed when seeing someone else working, not just how to do the moves. There are tons of threads that kids start here about not knowing how to tell people there are no more effects or moves. It is because they are not taking the time to learn how to be a performer just the moves. So it looks like to the lay person they have too much time on their hands. They think the same thing of a magician who is always coind effects or talking about magic.

  3. #13 October 14th, 2013

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    I quote this all the time, but to build on what krab is saying, there's a line from Kurosawa's The Lower Depths: "The things we love define us." Assuming that, what do you think it says about someone that they can only have one love or hobby or passion?

    That is not dead, which can eternal lie
    And with strange eons, even death may die

    Witching Hour Productions
    The Pitt and the Pendulum
  4. #14 October 15th, 2013

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    Quote Originally Posted by krab 1 View Post
    This is what I mean by too much time on their hands. They do XMC all the time. They have no other hobbies. I have other interest outside of magic. It is because of that I don't have to use magic as a crutch in social gatherings. So, people don't think I have too much time on my hands. Or that I'm a magic nerd. Or all I can talk about is magic.

    My biggest problem is these kids will walk up to the middle of a crowd I build doing my busking act and start doing their thing. They have the time to learn to juggle cards but not enough time to learn not to try and steel someone else's crowd. When not to perform. They need to learn the social skills needed when seeing someone else working, not just how to do the moves. There are tons of threads that kids start here about not knowing how to tell people there are no more effects or moves. It is because they are not taking the time to learn how to be a performer just the moves. So it looks like to the lay person they have too much time on their hands. They think the same thing of a magician who is always coind effects or talking about magic.
    I'm a little confused, who's "they"? People that bother your performances? I agree, it's certainly wrong of them to do. Not nice of them at all. What if they were breakdancers or beatboxers though, would you generalize everyone who loves doing that as people with no social ability and too much time on their hands? Maybe I'm misunderstanding.

    We all have the same exact amount of time each day throughout our lives, how we focus that time is our choice. Value or no value (which is subjective anyhow). If one sees zero value in something for themselves, I can understand why they'd want to omit focusing on that. However, to say the rest who do "have too much time on their hands" is plain insecurity.

    // andrei jikh
    vp of production / theory11
  5. #15 October 15th, 2013

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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrei View Post
    What if they were breakdancers or beatboxers though, would you generalize everyone who loves doing that as people with no social ability and too much time on their hands?
    If they use those skills to steal another performer's audience in the middle of his show? Yes.

    We all have the same exact amount of time each day throughout our lives, how we focus that time is our choice. Value or no value (which is subjective anyhow). If one sees zero value in something for themselves, I can understand why they'd want to omit focusing on that. However, to say the rest who do "have too much time on their hands" is plain insecurity.
    Again, it depends entirely on whether it's enriching your life or controlling it. In middle school and high school, I had no life. I was an obnoxious social retard with extremely narrow interests and a fanboy complex. Then I turned 18 and got over it. Started expanding my horizons and learned that there are things out there I had no idea I thought were fascinating. Now the question I hear most often is, "Where do you find stuff like this?" because I always have something new and cool to show or tell people about.

    That is not dead, which can eternal lie
    And with strange eons, even death may die

    Witching Hour Productions
    The Pitt and the Pendulum
  6. #16 October 15th, 2013

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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrei View Post
    I'm a little confused, who's "they"? People that bother your performances? I agree, it's certainly wrong of them to do. Not nice of them at all. What if they were breakdancers or beatboxers though, would you generalize everyone who loves doing that as people with no social ability and too much time on their hands? Maybe I'm misunderstanding.
    Yes I would. Anyone who doesn't have enough common sense to know when not to do something have no social grace. There is value in XCM, but the ones I see in my day to day life only do XMC and do it at all the wrong times. There is a part in my show where I say now let me do a simple cut and for some crazy crazy cuts. It gets a laugh and it lets people know this isn't your creepy uncle's card trick.

    I have a world of respect for people who are into breakin' and do it well. That is a skill I fell in love with back in the 80's. What I have no respect for are those who do not understand there is a time and place for everything.

    Quote Originally Posted by Andrei View Post
    We all have the same exact amount of time each day throughout our lives, how we focus that time is our choice. Value or no value (which is subjective anyhow). If one sees zero value in something for themselves, I can understand why they'd want to omit focusing on that. However, to say the rest who do "have too much time on their hands" is plain insecurity.

    People who are insecure are those who only focus on one thing and use it as a social crutch. I can talk classic and modern literature, blues music, classical music oldies and standards. I can talk cars and three different types of auto racing. I can talk video games.

    What I'm talking about are like the elitist raiders in World of Warcraft who can only talk why you suck because as a frost mage you are running more than 29% crit on a raid boss. Or XCM kids who can't talk to people with out a deck of cards in their hands and then that is all they can talk about. Or guitar players who say music starts and ends with SRV. That Yngwie Malmsteen is a no talent hack yet all the can play is 12 bar blues. This is what I'm talking about.

    Gaetan Bloom said in one of his lectures "Don't be a specialist. A specialist knows less and less about more and more on a little subject." Meaning, sure you know 400 card tricks, but you are lost if you loose your cards. Be curious about magic. All of magic. Be different. Take time to learn effects outside of your comfort zone. Same thing with life. Stop, look around, and see there is more out there than your one fixation. That people around you don't really care that your cards are limited to 250 deck. They might be into music, poetry and cooking, but all you want to talk about are your cards. All you know are your cards.

  7. #17 October 15th, 2013

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    Quote Originally Posted by krab 1 View Post
    Yes I would. Anyone who doesn't have enough common sense to know when not to do something have no social grace. There is value in XCM, but the ones I see in my day to day life only do XMC and do it at all the wrong times. There is a part in my show where I say now let me do a simple cut and for some crazy crazy cuts. It gets a laugh and it lets people know this isn't your creepy uncle's card trick.

    I have a world of respect for people who are into breakin' and do it well. That is a skill I fell in love with back in the 80's. What I have no respect for are those who do not understand there is a time and place for everything.




    People who are insecure are those who only focus on one thing and use it as a social crutch. I can talk classic and modern literature, blues music, classical music oldies and standards. I can talk cars and three different types of auto racing. I can talk video games.

    What I'm talking about are like the elitist raiders in World of Warcraft who can only talk why you suck because as a frost mage you are running more than 29% crit on a raid boss. Or XCM kids who can't talk to people with out a deck of cards in their hands and then that is all they can talk about. Or guitar players who say music starts and ends with SRV. That Yngwie Malmsteen is a no talent hack yet all the can play is 12 bar blues. This is what I'm talking about.

    Gaetan Bloom said in one of his lectures "Don't be a specialist. A specialist knows less and less about more and more on a little subject." Meaning, sure you know 400 card tricks, but you are lost if you loose your cards. Be curious about magic. All of magic. Be different. Take time to learn effects outside of your comfort zone. Same thing with life. Stop, look around, and see there is more out there than your one fixation. That people around you don't really care that your cards are limited to 250 deck. They might be into music, poetry and cooking, but all you want to talk about are your cards. All you know are your cards.
    How silly of me. You're right, since we're on a magic forum, let's talk politics, cooking, and poetry. No wait, tell me more about how all cardists have no lives because you took the time to get to know them so well on a personal level. Here's a news flash, we're not in a social gathering getting to know each other, so the fact that you're generalizing about a pretty large group of people due to a few bad apples, proves my point with regards to insecurity. All good!

    // andrei jikh
    vp of production / theory11
  8. #18 October 15th, 2013

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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrei View Post
    How silly of me. You're right, since we're on a magic forum, let's talk politics, cooking, and poetry. No wait, tell me more about how all cardists have no lives because you took the time to get to know them so well on a personal level. Here's a news flash, we're not in a social gathering getting to know each other, so the fact that you're generalizing about a pretty large group of people due to a few bad apples, proves my point with regards to insecurity. All good!
    That is a bit snippy. Really brings up the brand. Insecurity would be going into an interview with a movie star and spend half the time doing XCM instead of talking about the movie.

    First off this isn't a magic forum. This is a card magic and XCM forum. No where is there a sub-forum for parlor or stage or rope or other close up magic. It doesn't cover the wide world of magic, just card, some coins and XCM.

    The question was asked what do lay people think of XCM. They think the same thing they think of most magicians. That we have too much time on out hands. What I was pointing out that those who only know and talk about one thing really do have too much time on their hands. What I'm saying is look at Ricky Jay. We know the man loves magic, but he doesn't like magicians. Why? Because most magicians only talk about magic and they like to lift effects patter and all from more creative magicians. We know he is a great card man, but he can talk about a wide range of subjects. He gives lectures about everything but how to do magic.

    I'm not saying lets talk about cooking cars music and the like. I'm saying there has to be more to your life than XCM or magic in general.

  9. #19 October 15th, 2013

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    Quote Originally Posted by krab 1 View Post
    That is a bit snippy. Really brings up the brand. Insecurity would be going into an interview with a movie star and spend half the time doing XCM instead of talking about the movie.

    First off this isn't a magic forum. This is a card magic and XCM forum. No where is there a sub-forum for parlor or stage or rope or other close up magic. It doesn't cover the wide world of magic, just card, some coins and XCM.

    The question was asked what do lay people think of XCM. They think the same thing they think of most magicians. That we have too much time on out hands. What I was pointing out that those who only know and talk about one thing really do have too much time on their hands. What I'm saying is look at Ricky Jay. We know the man loves magic, but he doesn't like magicians. Why? Because most magicians only talk about magic and they like to lift effects patter and all from more creative magicians. We know he is a great card man, but he can talk about a wide range of subjects. He gives lectures about everything but how to do magic.

    I'm not saying lets talk about cooking cars music and the like. I'm saying there has to be more to your life than XCM or magic in general.
    Thirty seconds out of 4 minutes, your arithmetic may be bit off on that but thanks for watching. Certainly your opinion and you're entitled to it. What you were doing is generalizing a group of people based on your insecurity and then proceeded to judge and belittle them - including myself. All due to a few bad individuals you've met and specifically in this case - interrupted your show. Simple as that. As far as what lay people think of cardistry or magic - depends on the performer, I think that's already been answered in detail.

    // andrei jikh
    vp of production / theory11
  10. #20 October 15th, 2013

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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrei View Post
    Thirty seconds out of 4 minutes, your arithmetic may be bit off on that but thanks for watching. Certainly your opinion and you're entitled to it. What you were doing is generalizing a group of people based on your insecurity and then proceeded to judge and belittle them - including myself. All due to a few bad individuals you've met and specifically in this case - interrupting your show. Simple as that. As far as what lay people think of cardistry or magic - depends on the performer, I think that's already been answered in detail.
    You are doing the same thing saying I'm insecure as a person because I'm tired of no talent hacks trying to steel my crowd. I'm sick of seeing kids doing magic on youtube with nothing but their hands and junk in frame. I'm tired of people finding out I'm a magician and then lumping me in with those magicians who only talk about magic. Because I'm tired of seeing magic run into the ground by people who use it as a social crutch to talk to strangers. It's hard to work as a working pro and be insecure. It
    s hard to co-host a radio show and be insecure. What I am is someone who love the art and want to see it elevated back to where it once was before it because what it is today.

    P.S. I didn't watch it was shown to me by someone who wanted to know why all magicians have to make it all about them, and why I never do stuff like that. I went and watched now. The two i found first were both starting around 2 minute in and it was more than 30 seconds.

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