Cerca Trova ideas

[waynehouchin]

Do you have an idea for Cerca Trova? Post it here.

[MitchellStafiej]

What about a topic on the youth and their benefits to the art of magic. We can not only discuss the benefits but the downside to the youth who are emerging in the magic scene.

Mitchell

[remy]

Maybe something theory11 specific? for example, an in depth discussion on the 1on1 concept and how it's a revolutionary way to learn magic...or theories on the wire, and maybe some insight as to where that's headed. upcoming tricks, products, etc etc

[Creeper]

I think a good topic could self-doubt, and how to over-come it. I get it all the time, and I don't know what to do about it. I'm just sitting there with my deck, thinking to myself, am i any good? There are some many people who are better than me. I don't have that much talent.

[Tally]

One topic could be on how to improve showmanship.

[sky_lark]

Perhaps on modern magic vs past magic? How people are taking magic these days. How people are expecting magic to go along, what type of people or things are being influenced. For example, your everyday magic website vs Houdini. What are some things people are expecting magic to go to, go this way or that.

[b.boulton]

I think that what we would like to see come in the future would be a pretty good topic!

-brad

[RebelAce69]

Since we have a few female members on here now, Katie, Ashley and BabyCat (Kate) we should discuss the issues between gender and magic. Why it seems to be dominated by us men and the women are left in the shadows. And ways in which we can break those bonds, and make it so more female magicians actually pick up an interest in magic today.

I found an awesome article on BunnyBoyCollective.com in the Dynasty section (their forums) called The Invisible Elephant, check it out.

-RA69

[VagueTheory]

One of my BIG things about being indulged in this art, is practicing.

We should start a thread about practicing, and how to do it effectively. If you practice something for 10 hours, but do it wrong, it'll leave you in a huge pickle. Yeah, the Kosher kind.

Lots of people (I used to be one of them) learn a trick, practice it for a little bit and say, "I got this." Then they screw it all up in front of everyone. A perfect example is those kids on YouTube.

This thread should help a lot. As a fellow trumpet player, I know practice makes perfect, but only if you do it right.

Thanks guys. ;D

[Raito]

Magicians ignoring exposure and only taking action when it comes to them. I see magicians cry about exposure all the time yet I see hundreds if not thousands magic exposure sites which can be easily shut down by a report. Take action on exposure ignoing it is just as bad.. :P

[fridoliina]

self-doubt would be a good topic and how to overcome it. I see people posting everywhere things like, Oh i can never pull that of, oh thats to obvious i could never do that and still alot of professional magicians do them all the time.

[Aris.SA]

what about.. when is the.wire going to be released? =P

[SHANE BLACK]

I agree we can discuss showmanship and overcoming self-doubt. I would also like to see a topic on nothing but technique here and people offering real help to others. I'm also interested in Mitchells idea on discussing the youth and their impact on magic today.

[Ben Long]

I'd like to discuss practice. Not necessarily just the importance of practice, but the practice itself. How does one practice, how many tricks, for how long, how frequently, if one does warm-ups, practice speech, etc. I want to get really specific.

Do you start by doing some finger streches, followed by complex one-handed cuts in each hand, then move onto each routine and do each trick ten times, do a hundred bottom-deals, hold 26-card backpalms for five minutes each, practice speech and voice in the mirror, do a couple push-ups to keep healthy, then warm down with some fans and spreads and card throwing?

Do you turn on Seinfeld and stare at the TV for six hours with a deck in your hands?

That's my idea.

[Guardian452]

dealing with hecklers

[Krash]

How about a topic that revolves around magic supplies and the people who use them. Us. I think that it's somewhat important to everyone here, including me, to have a better understanding of themselves as a person and entertainer.

Are we letting the cards that we handle hinder our ability to be original? How about the patter that we use just because that's how it was taught on the DVD or in the book.

We should also hit on the topic of our own personal goals when it comes to our magic "life". Do we want to make this a career, or do we just do it for our personal pleasure and the pleasure of those we perform for?

If I think of anything else, I'll edit this post.

Keep on rockin'.

Shane K.

[CDarklock]

The dichotomy of fellowship and competition in magic. While we're a close group that feels great kinship, we're also all competitors. We all have our own balance between these two ends of the scale, and our own ways of dealing with it.

[b.boulton]

what about.. when is the.wire going to be released? =P

just to point it out....the wire will come after control, prophet, then whatever they are doing with dm.

the crew is looking for a break in the production schedule in order to finish it up.

[Snorri]

i like the idea od discussing practice, showmanship and that weird little thing that happens that is not quite stage fright but that nervousness that can happen when you perform for certain people be they strangers or friends.

I also like the idea of discussing the gender thing in magic because as of late I have seen some awesome ladies out there that are doing amazing magic.
Ladies have been involved in magic for quite some time .....they have never been too prominenet though.
Snorri

[Zellbo]

my suggestion is having a topic on developing personal style to magic effects. we often buy a dvd based on the performance we saw. upon getting the dvd and watching we often perform the effect the same way it was taught and demonstrated.

another topic is: what inspires you to be a performer and a creator of magical effects. while we all sit in awe at the plethora of "new" magic that has come out the past couple years, we all at one time have said 'why didnt i think of that?' or 'why cant i come up with the next great trick?'

[jimbowmanjr]

Magic hype: What causes it? Who pushes it? It's effect on creators and the marketplace.

Books vs. Video: What are your opinions on the current state of how magic is being taught in a 'distance learning' environment and the serious lack of actual 1-on-1 training and performance?

Old School vs. New School: The Classics and The Stuff that Slays/Kills/Melts

Where is magic headed and where do you see magic in 10 years? 20 years? 30 years? Are gadgets and electronics going to eventually take over magic given the rate of technological advancement?

Just random thoughts since I forgot Uncle John's Bathroom Reader today....

--Jim

[chris17]

I think there should be topic on how to make magic not magic but entertainment, because im tired of people feeling like im tricking them instead i want them to be entertained more then anything.

[CDarklock]

I like Jim's idea on old school v. new school, but I suspect the old school is vastly outnumbered on this forum. ;)

[jimbowmanjr]

I like Jim's idea on old school v. new school, but I suspect the old school is vastly outnumbered on this forum. ;)

Kenner can represent old school...maybe Lee too he is getting up there =)

I am pretty sure there are a few old schoolers that glance over these forums from the Cafe from time to time. I agree though it would be tough to have a balanced conversation given the audience =/

--Jim

[Zimflee]

Cerca Trova idea-

Is there an 11th Theory? I've thought of one, but tell me what you guys think before I post it.

~Chris

[Steerpike]

Here's a couple of ideas.

Ivory Tower: The biggest problem I'm noticing is people going on and on about this method or that theory, and I can tell instantly whether or not they've actually tested any of this under real world conditions in performance. More often than not, they haven't. As much as I love the internet, it's not substitution for experience. Rather than fighting the online appeal, how can we make it work outside of simple marketing and the like?

The Delicate Art of Shameless Self-Promotion: I've heard some people wonder how David Blaine and Criss Angel got on TV and they didn't. Well, I don't know about Criss, but David performed constantly and got in the local newspaper in Manhattan. Then he did magic for the receptionist at MTV headquarters on Broadway. She introduced him to her bosses. Then he did the same with ABC. To succeed, you have to promote yourself relentlessly. Success won't just come to you. It ain't gonna happen. A discussion of self-promotion may be in order.

Who Are You?: I put together 2 articles over at Ellusionist on the subject of actualizing one's identity and turning ambition into reality. A more indpeth discussion of these subjects may be in order.

[FliXeRoCk107]

I have one. Will there eventually be a point in time where magic creation will stop because all effects have been created? Also, what about my age group (12) creating effects that are atually good enough to be sold on a site?

[2ndDeal]

What is new generation?

Only change I see is that people do more videos and use more black decks. There is no real "New Generation"

[CDarklock]

What is new generation?

The magicians of today compared to the magicians of thirty years ago.

You know, when there WERE no black decks or home videos.

[AllanLuu]

I think i good cerca trova post would be:

Magic: a Hobbiest or a Profesional?

I think it would be a cool topic to elaborate on.

[daffy]

IMHO, discussing how to use marketing, cinema, etc. to build plots could be interesting...

[Monkeyofmanipulation]

I think it would be interesting to talk about the relationship between audience and performer. Whether they should like you for your "magic" or for who you are.

Just a thought.

Also performing is a great confidense builder for life in general. Going up to and talkig to random people without fear is something.

[Liam Carrie]

History Of magic

[CDarklock]

The effect of alcohol on magical innovation. Are you more or less creative when drunk?

[audun123]

I think "Cerca Trova" is more a way to live your life. Not only magic related but How u live and everything u do.

What do u guys think about this?

[Cyrus]

I think "Cerca Trova" is more a way to live your life. Not only magic related but How u live and everything u do.

What do u guys think about this?

I think you should read the first post in the topic, thats not what this topic is about.

An idea may be, how important is style in magic and why. What defines style or what all does style consist of.

[Mic Wong]

how about when it's a good time to release 707, 606, 505 and 303 after the 909s....


maybe a topic for good names to use for the collector's edition boxset of T11 decks by the time the 10th special design deck is released.....

maybe when it's a good idea to search the warehouse to see if there is this hidden box of lost 1st edition guardians.

maybe good suggestions for "the next wynns".

[AllanLuu]

How about a topic about the thoughts of using fancy decks during performances? I think that would be a very beneficial topic for alot of people.

[The Dark Angel]

How about discussing cards that some people might think are gimmicked (Guardians, Black Ghost, etc.) and if these are good or bad.

[MitchellStafiej]

How about "Magic On TV" and the up/downsides to it.

Mitchell

[Xdelamuertex]

"Cerca Trova" — seek and you shall find — is shown on a five-century-old fresco by Giorgio Vasari, "Battle of Marciano in the Chiana Valley," in the council hall of Florence's Palazzo Vecchio. Researchers believe these cryptic words could be a clue to the location of a long-lost Leonardo da Vinci painting.

[Liam Carrie]

I think they should have a whole post on misderection or crowd control

[Sean_Raf]

I have an idea to throw onto the table:

Why do we, as magicians, often feel the need to fool other magicians? Why is it that we have to over complicate things with gimmicks and intricate sleights in order to prove that what we say "really" is what we say?

What will it take for us to forget that not every layman has the 'magician's eye' that we supposedly have to spot a double lift a mile away.

It often annoys me when I see others say, that's too obvious or I figured it out therefore it's rubbish and laymen won't like it, I'd like to see what others have to say on the matter.

- Sean

[Steerpike]

I'm going to have to agree with this one.

I recall a conversation back in the day. I was arguing privately with another magician. He was slagging off another known name (I won't say who) and insisting that this performer was a bad magician overall. I told him that my parents saw videos of him and thought he was slick. They liked his shows. I'd hoped to communicate that there really is no point in arguing taste.

Instead, this guy says to me, "What would they know? They're not magicians."

[JoeCarr]

basically, why overcomplicate something, when something similar but easier can look just as magical.. ?? :)

[JoeCarr]

or a killer....

XCM VS. MAGIC

lol, i know thats irrelevant i just love seeing the arguements, though i personally dont like XCM what so ever, it impresses very few people i know and is no where near as entertaining as magic, sure it can be used to spice something up, but i believe it has no real place in magic, and you should choose one or the other...:)

[Nate Malini]

I have an idea to throw onto the table:

Why do we, as magicians, often feel the need to fool other magicians? Why is it that we have to over complicate things with gimmicks and intricate sleights in order to prove that what we say "really" is what we say?

What will it take for us to forget that not every layman has the 'magician's eye' that we supposedly have to spot a double lift a mile away.

It often annoys me when I see others say, that's too obvious or I figured it out therefore it's rubbish and laymen won't like it, I'd like to see what others have to say on the matter.

- Sean

Thats Good.

[LBarnes]

Seeing as "theft of another persons creation" is a hot topic this week, why don't we discuss this further?

[dummyisdumb]

Seeing as "theft of another persons creation" is a hot topic this week, why don't we discuss this further?

Wayne would love to post that.

[MoJoe13]

I know I'm not the first to mention this, but I'd like to see more on the role of XCM in card magic. Or vice versa. Seems that a division is forming between the two.

Katie E. said in a post that XCM is the future of magic. I'm dying to know what other T11 people think.

Me, I'm not so sure, because there is nothing magic about it. Personally, I see XCM as a highly sophisticated form of juggling. It takes practice and dexterity to master, but doesn't present the same form of mystery that regular card magic does.

Don't get me wrong: I'm impressed and appreciative of all the cardists who post videos here. I incorporate XCM into my card magic. But XCM will always be a supplement to my magic, not my entire act. Even if I could do half of what many on the forum could do, my foundation will rest on "Pick a card" and the like.

[Aos]

I know I'm not the first to mention this, but I'd like to see more on the role of XCM in card magic. Or vice versa. Seems that a division is forming between the two.

Katie E. said in a post that XCM is the future of magic. I'm dying to know what other T11 people think.

Me, I'm not so sure, because there is nothing magic about it. Personally, I see XCM as a highly sophisticated form of juggling. It takes practice and dexterity to master, but doesn't present the same form of mystery that regular card magic does.

Don't get me wrong: I'm impressed and appreciative of all the cardists who post videos here. I incorporate XCM into my card magic. But XCM will always be a supplement to my magic, not my entire act. Even if I could do half of what many on the forum could do, my foundation will rest on "Pick a card" and the like.

XCM has nothing to do with magic. In fact, the sloppier you are with cards the better reactions you will get because people wont expect you to perform intricate sleight of hand moves.

[2ndDeal]

Old classics vs latest hits.

[cklam]

Seeing that there are a lot of youths in the magic community, I think it's good to discuss more about the issue between education and magic.

What I mean is, some of the young members think that the importance of education in life is rather low comparing to practicing their magic.

e.g.
I remember someone said that they have played with his deck of cards during class and the deck was confiscated by the teacher after all. Other people said that they decide to become a professional magicians, so why bother listening in class.

Yet, it seems to me that not many professional magicians have ever address their opinions on such topic.

I would like to see more discussion on this, if possible.






Ken

[Dustin Lynes]

I think a good topic could self-doubt, and how to over-come it. I get it all the time, and I don't know what to do about it. I'm just sitting there with my deck, thinking to myself, am i any good? There are some many people who are better than me. I don't have that much talent.

This is pretty solid... maybe overcoming nerves or how to get a decent gig.

[JoeCarr]

ALERT: KICKASS CERCA TROVA!

I think the next cerca trova should be the much debated 'i worked it out from the video, why can i not perform it!' classic...

apparantly, ive heard a few people say aaron fisher say that it is okay to work it out from a performance, and i believe no one should put up a performance that doesnt protect the trick 100%//

the cerca trova can delve into ethics, morals, peoples opinions, legalities, etc...

just my thought, i think it would make a good debate...

'is it right to learn a trick from a video?'

also is up to date with 'fresh' topics (the clipshift)

[d00m5day]

i like the old classics to new tricks one

and the issue about education and magic

=)

[Shodan]

I came in here to post pretty much exactly what cklam wrote a couple of posts up. School vs. magic has cropped up on these forums several times and I for one would like to see what some of the T11 artists have to say on the matter.

Cheers,
David.

[Jakeh]

How about Simplicity versus Complexity.

Recently, I've felt a little bit inadequate compared to some people here because it seems a lot of people are using these really difficult-type sleights whereas I seem to still be doing basic/above basic type stuff. So I'd like to hear what people have to say on this subject. Like, is it necessary to learn the pass and stuff like that?

Yeah, I think it'd be a cool discussion to have. :)

[Sean_Raf]

I have an idea to throw onto the table:

Why do we, as magicians, often feel the need to fool other magicians? Why is it that we have to over complicate things with gimmicks and intricate sleights in order to prove that what we say "really" is what we say?

What will it take for us to forget that not every layman has the 'magician's eye' that we supposedly have to spot a double lift a mile away.

It often annoys me when I see others say, that's too obvious or I figured it out therefore it's rubbish and laymen won't like it, I'd like to see what others have to say on the matter.

- Sean

(*mutters something about word count*)

[JoeCarr]

ALERT: KICKASS CERCA TROVA!

I think the next cerca trova should be the much debated 'i worked it out from the video, why can i not perform it!' classic...

apparantly, ive heard a few people say aaron fisher say that it is okay to work it out from a performance, and i believe no one should put up a performance that doesnt protect the trick 100%//

the cerca trova can delve into ethics, morals, peoples opinions, legalities, etc...

just my thought, i think it would make a good debate...

'is it right to learn a trick from a video?'
(*mutters something about stealing seans idea*)

[wicca]

I think we should have a topic on the development of magic.

I think magic can be different the types of magic that is done now can change to become more real more believable in society.

Magic can change but I dont know what to and how.

[foolzsight]

After seeing a post in the general discussion I think a Cerca Trova should deal with the term 'purist'.

What is a purist?
Is it someone who doesn't use gimmicks at all?
Is it a state of mind, an approach to magic?
Is it an ego-driven approach?
Though harder, is it better to be able to do everything, anything impromptu? (I remember reading a thread in the card magic forum about a guy who did a haunted deck, and when approached to do it again didn't have any loops...didn't know a way to do it otherwise...it ended up hurting him and letting down a spectator that had been raving about him)

I think if everyone stays respectful it could be a very good topic to discuss.

[adjones]

After seeing a post in the general discussion I think a Cerca Trova should deal with the term 'purist'.

What is a purist?
Is it someone who doesn't use gimmicks at all?
Is it a state of mind, an approach to magic?
Is it an ego-driven approach?
Though harder, is it better to be able to do everything, anything impromptu? (I remember reading a thread in the card magic forum about a guy who did a haunted deck, and when approached to do it again didn't have any loops...didn't know a way to do it otherwise...it ended up hurting him and letting down a spectator that had been raving about him)

I think if everyone stays respectful it could be a very good topic to discuss.

I second this motion!

[Pavan R]

I think there could more more forums. A general off-topic forum maybe. A forum for people to post their own tricks and get feedback. A reputation bar and names for people with over 'x' amount of posts would be nice too.

[adjones]

I think there could more more forums. A general off-topic forum maybe. A forum for people to post their own tricks and get feedback. A reputation bar and names for people with over 'x' amount of posts would be nice too.

Uhh, that's great and all, but this is the topic for Cerca Trova ideas. :rolleyes:

[Ben Long]

I think it would be nice to look at magic from an actor's standpoint. Perhaps we could look into things that we can do as performers to enhance our magic.

There is a whole range of things we could discuss, and not necessarily just developing patter, but projection, eye contact, our body language, and what those things instill in our audience. Or just in general how we can instill feeling in our audience.

[Jakeh]

Speaking of Cerca Trova, where is this months?

[Chr!s]

Essays and interviews with the leading lights of today's magic scene.
Imagine...
An essay on utilising misdirection to its full potential by david stone!
An interview with Dave Forrest or Jay Sankey on creativity!
Apollo Robbins on audience management, Joshua Jay on writing, Derren Brown or Banachek on the evolution of medern mentalism...

An ongoing series of informative, educational, and actually interesting articles, on the subjects that REALLY matter to us, as artists!
That would be amazing.

C!

[Shadow782]

After seeing a post in the general discussion I think a Cerca Trova should deal with the term 'purist'.

What is a purist?
Is it someone who doesn't use gimmicks at all?
Is it a state of mind, an approach to magic?
Is it an ego-driven approach?
Though harder, is it better to be able to do everything, anything impromptu? (I remember reading a thread in the card magic forum about a guy who did a haunted deck, and when approached to do it again didn't have any loops...didn't know a way to do it otherwise...it ended up hurting him and letting down a spectator that had been raving about him)

I think if everyone stays respectful it could be a very good topic to discuss.

I third this motion!

[Jonas]

Maybe something theory11 specific? for example, an in depth discussion on the 1on1 concept and how it's a revolutionary way to learn magic...

Exactly how is it revolutionary? Besides, it's not very T11-specific if you ask me, Penguin Magic did it first, using the name "instant downloads".

[harapanong]

Hey Jonas:

Maybe it's revolutionary because they managed to package the "instant downloads" thing into something that many believe to be new and exciting.

Cerca Trova idea: Where is Theory11 headed?

- harapan. magic!

[Jonas]

Maybe it's revolutionary because they managed to package the "instant downloads" thing into something that many believe to be new and exciting.

By using different advertising techniques, you can make anything seem new it seems.

[trashmanf]

oh my god, did you guys see Joel Pashcall's new AMAZING false pivot cut. it is so weak.

Seriously there are over 100 free tutorials for cuts that are much better than this one.

Why does theory11 have to resort to such weak crud to get their $5 from the kiddies. Why not actually hire someone GOOD (like have Andrei teach a cool display)

another example is "flo" or whatever it's just a dribble pointed sideways. what the hell.

[adjones]

So don't buy it, it's that simple, dumb ass. There's no need to complain. For beginners like me, it was a nice cut to start out with. If it's not your style, or your skill level, just don't buy it. :rolleyes:

[Aris.SA]

I agree with you, but I think you are IN LOVE with joel paschall :P I'm telling this taking almost all your post where he is menctioned and there you go to defend him, admire, love, etc. :P

[adjones]

I agree with you, but I think you are IN LOVE with joel paschall :P I'm telling this taking almost all your post where he is menctioned and there you go to defend him, admire, love, etc. :P

Nah, I'm not in love with him. But having met him and got to hang out with him, I know he's a really good guy, and doesn't deserve half the crap he gets on here. Me and him are homies... fo real. ;)

[M_dalgashon]

I think we should do a cerca trova about misdirection.
In my opinion, misdirection is what separates a good magician from a gret magician. Because, anyone can do sleights, with some practise... But the secret is in the presentation and misdirection. Almost all sleights can be revealed, or at least flashed, if the spectators are really burning the cards, so misdirection is really key.
So I think it will be interesting to see how different magicians think about misdirection, and most importantly, how do they practise misdirection. There are lots of tricks that are really all about misdirection (a simple example is the Invisible Palm).

[M_dalgashon]

oh my god, did you guys see Joel Pashcall's new AMAZING false pivot cut. it is so weak.

Seriously there are over 100 free tutorials for cuts that are much better than this one.

Why does theory11 have to resort to such weak crud to get their $5 from the kiddies. Why not actually hire someone GOOD (like have Andrei teach a cool display)

another example is "flo" or whatever it's just a dribble pointed sideways. what the hell.

What the hell yourself... Learn to write and comment properly before criticizing other people.
If you don't like Joel's new 1on1, or any DVD, book, etc. you can say it politely, and also explain why you didn't like it, so people can learn from your so called review.
So go spend your precious 5$ on something else and leave us alone.

[Nate Malini]

What happened to June"s Cerca Trova?

[foolzsight]

What happened to June"s Cerca Trova?

Maybe that'll be July's Cerca Trova...

[mnwushu89]

we have all heard the saying "a magician never revelas his secrets" and the unwritten rule of the magicians code which i am a full supporter of however this is a contradiction to an extent. None of us were born magicians and some way on our way to discovering magic we were revealed a secret to a trick and it went from there. so for the cerca trova forum i just want peoples thoughts on the unwritten rule and code does it exist? whats the difference between exposing and teaching? how do we decide who to reveal and not to reveal to? i guess it could be a thread on exposure but i was wanting a discussion on the magicians code itself than on exposiure if that makes any sense.

[nick11link]

we have all heard the saying "a magician never revelas his secrets" and the unwritten rule of the magicians code which i am a full supporter of however this is a contradiction to an extent. None of us were born magicians and some way on our way to discovering magic we were revealed a secret to a trick and it went from there. so for the cerca trova forum i just want peoples thoughts on the unwritten rule and code does it exist? whats the difference between exposing and teaching? how do we decide who to reveal and not to reveal to? i guess it could be a thread on exposure but i was wanting a discussion on the magicians code itself than on exposiure if that makes any sense.


Wow, that's a really good question. I've always though that a magician should never reveal their secrets regardless, but at the same time I wouldn't know any tricks if every magician followed that rule. Perhaps you, the performer, should only reveal tricks to other magicians who you know will use the trick to amaze, not to show off that they know the secret.

I never show my methods to spectators, even when I'm offered money (that's only happened once). As for unwritten rule, I don't think there is an unwritten rule. Most magicians learn someplace or other that they shouldn't reveal tricks to spectators. That's always been what I believed until I discovered people exposing tricks rampantly on YouTube and Metacafe.

Needless to say, people have been exposing tricks long before these websites came into existence. However, since they've been created, video sharing sites have been the biggest platform for magic exposure, and as a result the "magicians code" has been destroyed by little ten year old kids with webcams.

Long story short, I believe the magicians code is a great concept but definetly not an unwritten law, not any more.

[thehumanbomb]

What do you do in a situation where you don't get any reaction to a trick? For instance, when a spectator didn't understand what you did?

[adjones]

What do you do in a situation where you don't get any reaction to a trick? For instance, when a spectator didn't understand what you did?

Rework my presentation.

[Sean_Raf]

I have an idea to throw onto the table:

Why do we, as magicians, often feel the need to fool other magicians? Why is it that we have to over complicate things with gimmicks and intricate sleights in order to prove that what we say "really" is what we say?

What will it take for us to forget that not every layman has the 'magician's eye' that we supposedly have to spot a double lift a mile away.

It often annoys me when I see others say, that's too obvious or I figured it out therefore it's rubbish and laymen won't like it, I'd like to see what others have to say on the matter.

- Sean

In light of Danny Gizzle's comment on the podcast last night, I thought I'd try and bring this one to the forefront again.

- Sean

[magicman384]

my cera trova idea is what actually is impromptu?

[thehumanbomb]

Rework my presentation.

I'm talking about in the short term, like at that moment. Not in the long term. But I understand what you're saying.

[Isaac Kane]

typically i will never tell how to do a trick... but i will teach a trick only if i can tell the person is as devoted to the art as i am...but if its another magician i will make him swap me for a trick

[FOO:L]

in light of the constant arguments going on in the forums, I'd like to suggest a cerca trova topic.
Simply, what makes magic stick in peoples minds? The actual magic (i.e sleights ect) or the way youve presented the effect.

[Isaac Kane]

i think the thing that sticks in peoples mind is the fact that they cannot comprehend what just happened which is why they call it magic...
people have called things "magic" since they couldnt comprehend that the shaman was simply fooling their eyes with simply trickery

[Matthew Sims]

I believe the next "Cerca Trova" should be about self expression. I would gladly share some thoughts on this from my upcoming book. Let me know what you guys think.

Matthew Sims

[BlueCuzco]

I think the question of teaching vs. exposing is interesting but, for me at least, simple. If I think the person in question really wants to learn the trick and is willing to put some good effort into it, then I'll go ahead and show them. To date, I've never shown anyone anything.

Seeing that there are a lot of youths in the magic community, I think it's good to discuss more about the issue between education and magic. What I mean is, some of the young members think that the importance of education in life is rather low comparing to practicing their magic.

e.g. I remember someone said that they have played with his deck of cards during class and the deck was confiscated by the teacher after all. Other people said that they decide to become a professional magicians, so why bother listening in class. Yet, it seems to me that not many professional magicians have ever address their opinions on such topic. I would like to see more discussion on this, if possible.

Education and magic is interesting, but again I think is simple resolved. Do you really want to become a professional magician? Is the best way to do that to skrew learning and just do magic, or get a good education, a job, and slowly let yourself into a magic profession so that you have your old degree/job to fall back on if necessary? It's more of a practical question than anything and depends on the person. I for one am just doing magic as a very serious hobby, so this isn't an issue for me. My conduct record is spotless besides practicing with cards in class. :) Pretty cool, I think.

Here's my pet topic that hasn't been suggested so far and is rather important to me: isolation. I come on here and see all these people with MAD skills, but have never seen one in real life. Even just plain magicians are scarce, let alone "underground magicians", let alone underground magicians my age. Unlike other art forms, finding a person like yourselves, in my experience, is rare. By a random stroke of fate I found one on a recent trip, but he's gone now. Tragedy.

[carameo]

i think thats a good idea

[Mikeoo92]

Lets all create a magic trick!!!

[adjones]

That would be something more suited for a Saturday Night Contest rather than a Cerca Trova. Cerca Trova's, IMHO, are just more for discussion about a certain topic.

[popchris3]

What do you mean by Saturday Night Contests, Drew?

[praetoritevong]

Chris, every saturday night we have a little contest, which can be any range of things from submitting questions to creating flourishes..

[popchris3]

Where would these be held?

[praetoritevong]

They are posted in a new thread each Saturday evening in the General Discussion forum. :)

[Graham Wiebe]

we should talk about the definition of magic. what is it? how do we as magicians create it? and why do some tricks seem to be lacking magic?

[magicmalnsk]

August 08: Get out there and perform

[Monkeyofmanipulation]

Whether there is something that can be done to stop magic exposure? And perhaps touch on the subject of our evolving audience.

Just a thought...

-Jon

[neco]

how about magic all over the world i mean what are your thoughts??? in america what is the trend?? in europe??? in asia?? we all know that all the well known site in the net are all based in the u.s. and europe...

[The Dark Angel]

How about where we think magic will be in 10 years. I'm pretty sure that the magic scene today bears no resemblance to the magic scene 10 years, so what will it be like in the future?

TDA

[magicman384]

how youtube and exposure effects the magic community

[bcp on pcp]

Actuallly performing for people rather than the internet.